My first company was, was EA, which was, um, uh, the opposite of, of why -- where I, I am now. You know, it was -- EA was this gigantic thing, and, and I was, uh, um, not that influential in this big machine. And, uh, it's, it's kind of a dream killer, like you -- like when you see so much of the -- when you see the industry from above, uh, and you know everything -- you know the numbers, you know what works, you know what doesn't work. Uh, they got it down to a science. And, uh, and it's like kind of creatively, uh, depressing. Uh, you know, you just don't believe in anything. So, uh -- but I still got a lot from that. You know, I still got some, uh, interesting, um, uh, pragmatics and, and approaches. So, like when I then, uh, broke away from, from this big company to make my own little company with Arkane, uh, in, in '99, I had to force myself to be naïve again. And I had to like forget about, uh, everything I knew because otherwise I would have been paralyzed by my fears. And, you know, anything that I wanted to do was deemed impossible, uh, you know, starting a game with four people and doing our own engine and doing RPG on PC, you know, a dying platform, and, you know, every -- everything that, uh, back then the big companies would tell you. Um, and, uh, and then, you know, working with Valve and for Valve, actually, we were, um, uh -- we've been working closely to them - was, was great because suddenly like these guys are really, really smart. And we, we got like, again, very practical tip from them, uh, in their approach. And, uh, they, they have a very brutal, um, you know, is the game fun or not kind of -- kind of way to decide, uh, what is going to make it in the game. So, it's not about ego of the -- of the game designers. It's more like, okay, game designers have an idea. Uh, let's not judge it. It sounds cool. Um, and, uh, put it in the game and, and, and, you know, and then test -- testing or blind testing is even better because it's basically people that just come in, play your game, and you just observe them. You don't have to ask them anything. Uh, and it tells you a lot about your future as in is the game fun or not. And then you'd make decisions based on that. There's no, you know, no ego there. Uh, so that -- those are the kind of things that, that we learn. And I think, yeah, every time - you know, now we are working with Bethesda and, then again, we learned some new stuff with them. Um, so, it's been 13 years now of, uh - what, 14 years, I think, of, uh, of, uh, Arkane. And, uh, altogether it's, it's going to be, uh, 19 years of career at this point. And, uh, yes, I've, I've learned, uh, from every companies we've, we've worked with from, you know, from, uh, close or from a distance.
